My views on Reservation/Quota In Higher Education Institutes In India
When I first heard of this reservation or quota system in iit-iim, medicine etc. my reaction was okay another stupid step from politicians. But then media brought it up everyday making me think over it again and again. So finally it reached a stage where I couldnt sleep. So here I'm at 1.34am in night writing this down.
One thing. I am absolutely convinced that this step is not well intended and neither it is being brought up in national interest. Because anyone who can think knows that only major benifit of whole mandal comission episode is division of at-least north and rural india on caste lines.
Here are the few points which make me think why reservations as proposed is politically motivated rather than actually well thought out and well intended plan.
1. There wasnt any agitation small or big going on in favor of this proposed reservation
2. How many people it will really benefit few 100s or may be 1000s but what about 750M strong SC/ST and OBCs?
3. There were few elections coming up. But I suspect its not becuase of these elections but the big one staring next year. U.P. the state which votes strictly on caste lines. (May be after Bihar)
But why should i be bothered? Im working in one of the best MNC in the world. Option to sattle abroad any day. Hey its not affecting me. Okay. But in India if you don't oppose that means you agree. Here the loudest voice will have its way. Because if we wont oppose they will come up with another thing like reservations in private sector. Well even that wont matter. Bcoz Im in MNC and I know if ill be in top 50% im safe. What a selfish thinking I've. I feel ashamed. But this is how most of us thinks. I guess.
But friends what apalled me was courageless, spineless, mouthless leadership of all the political parties. None, absolutely none. No political party cameout opposing it in national interest. Have they stopped seeing national interest or their only interest is power? I'm watching this happening everyday. No party, NGO, institute or anyone... even those who claim to be nationalist parties... those who claim to be nationalist institute and who has bharat mata at their heart are mum and not uttering single word. I'm saying convince me by argument that reservation is the way to make india a homogeneus state! I'm all for making india a homogeneus state. Where everyone is same. No one in train would ask me my last name. When I goto complain about noise pollution Police Inspector wont ask me if I'm Muslim. But is this the way? Are we solving the problem or creating bigger one? British went but taught their methods to rule to these thugs.
Why I'm opposed to this method of solving india's disparity.
1. Data being taken is very stale. Its almost 30 years means 1 generation old. In between indian economy has liberalised. So we need latest data and sample before we go any further.
2. It doesn't take all the factors into consideration. Means it just sees what's your caste not where did you study ? Which city or villege you are from? It seems perpetual
-I studied in local language. Im not from english medium. My ex was from same school, her father was making more money than my dad. She had access to all the resources what I had and definitely she was more brilliant than me. But she was OBC and she got into same college as mine because of her OBC status. Did it really serve the purpose? Ok. It did. I could see here almost every day for 4 years :)
Here is my point. Make the system fairer. those who have studied in private school, in semi-urban or urban centers should by default get converted into general category. Because once the level playing field it laid down there shouldnt be un-due advantages. About economic status. I guess its debateable. We not only want affluents but also those in middle class out of this reservation game. But you cannot apply same yard stick across india because 60000Rs/Annum income in village may be decent but paltry in any metro. So you should apply reasonable standard. Orphan Brahmin, Rajput kid is at equal disadvantage as any poor SC/ST/OBC kid. What about them?
Another valid argument is you are given reservation at under graduate level. There shouldn't be any reservation for post graduate. Then tomorrow you will say there will seperate queues at railway stations for SC/ST/OBCs. Sport people will be selected based on their caste and creed not on their performance.
So here is my list of items which should also be taken into account if you want to give reservation.
1. Place where he/she lives
2. Type of School where he/she studied (government needs to classify them. use crisil i wont trust anyone else :D)
3.His/Her income (not absurd 4-5lakhs even a lakh in rural area is decent to provide decent education. My father's last paycheck was 8000+)
Another point is that once father or mother have taken the benefit of reservation their family should be converted into general category. Reservation is suppose to create level playing field. It shouldnt be used as an instrument of reverse descrimination.
We should talk and act in such a way that india becomes a homogeneus society. Another apalling thing to see on TV Channels is the way learned FM supporting reservation, PM keeping mum as of he has been put gun on his turban and asked not to utter a word. In whole episode I found 2 ppl with courage. 1. Sam Pitroda 2. Delhi's Shiv Sena chief.
As Sam said no one disagrees about end result. Issue is means is neither justified nor looks well intentioned, well thought thru if well intentioned.
Another bigger issue I feel is no one is talking about how can we end this menace. Everyone is talking about how can we mess our system more and more. We should have comprehensive survey atleast on the status of SC/STs that have their condition improved in last 60 years or it has remained just as it is. If thats the case we should think beyond reservation.
Will the government admit that it can't think beyond anything else so only thing it can do is reserve seats. But when more than 50% of students drop out of 10th what is the point in reserving seats at IIT and IIMs. It seems it is being done to benefit sons and daughters of IAS, IPS and other reserved category Government Employees. Will Arjun singh divert his energy towards decrease this dropout rate, will he provide more toilets in government schools so that girl children wont dropout because of lack of sanitary facilities? Can he divert his energies to ensure that Teachers are present in school. And all students who are 10th pass knows how to write and read their name in their native language, hindi and english. Because I know many boys and girls who are 10th pass but cant even write their names in those 3 languages. That is the quality of our education.
One funniest thing. Media. Though they are covering all the events I am yet to read article oppossing reservation and its implications. Read few articles like 1 from editor of HT. but it was more like passing thought from him.
See as I view it its litmus test from Congress and arjun singh if they wont find much opposition there is bigger one coming. Reservation in private sector? So are we waiting for that one or we guys need to pull out of our bed?
Why are we so quiet? Isnt it affecting you guys? Or im just getting too involved? Or just crazy idiot who doesnt have to worry about anything so he can worry on all these stupid issues?
posted by Shreyas @ 1:04 PM
15 Comments:
nice...
I think you should put the link in comments on the petition. Let ppl see and agree to it.
http://www.petitiononline.com/No_Quota/petition.html
What say ??
Reservation cant be abolished but it can be minimised gradually.
It should (definitely not in jobs) should follow a policy of
disallowing a person's offsprings from the benefit of reservation if
the person himself/herself has been a beneficiary of reservation.In
this case reservation has served the purpose of
emancipation/upliftment and are on the level playing field with
others.Allowing further reservation in the family will only promote
incomepetence.Hence over a period of many generations,reservation will
not be needed!!
I agree there should be a phased reduction. Not phased incremental to make the open category obsolete. Like Shreyas said, this was supposed to be gone after 20 years. Infact it went up after 25 and is going more up after 50. So by this rate by 100 years of independence, they will have 100% reservation. Wow! My fellow OC students, lets migrate all elsewhere.
hai shreyas.
i wanna put this post in my blog with your permission.
I am hearing from my child hood that Government has given reservations to people in all education institutuins and also in all Govt. Jobs.
I at present stage suprised to see that not even 1% of people of that cateogery is developed as Government has thinked and introduced Reservations in India, This shows Strong failure in thought of Government and caused mere loss by loosing needy and merit Students service to the Nation. Now I strongly Request Government to Re-think and Remove Reservations and introduce new plan and method to develop so called people.
If we go on keep quite and not think for Nation we will once again become slaves in the hands of Foregin People.
Government has to Develop the Primary education to all people till 12th class free with world class standards and provide all required things for all those who are socially and economically backward people. This will increase strength of people and also strength of Nation.
Instead of giving good education at Right age if Govt provide reservations it will not develop tham and it will give wrong sight to people that with out studying and not doing hard work we can get seats and also jobs.
So if we remove Reservations in Graduation and higher level then competition incerases and all will work hard and become more intelectual and then become strong in subject to gain ranks, this leads to build strong nation and good citizens and also good people to live socially and economically equally.
Please Make Nation Strong and Avoid False Methods( Reservations) to make it
I have put forward some facts about Postgraduate courses Admissions in Medical colleges of Maharashtra.The fact is that open category students get less than 50% of PG seats.
Please visit http://maharashtramedicos.blogspot.com for detail artical.
Also let me know what is situation of PG admission in your state.
hey, u mirror quite a lot of my sentiments.
but cool down..not in ur passion for the cause..but in ur head u should be COOL..while ur heart should beat with passionate .
thinking with a cool head and with cunning...see the main point is we need support...now dont expect everybody to be as passionate about the cause as you are..but people can be 'tricked' into supporting eg in delhi because traders had faced a lot of manhandling by the govt,they came out to support yfe ppl in delhi.
so we have to be intelligent enough to trick ppl into joining,motivate them. i have already given example of how visuals of kids suffering (aims doc on hunger strike and anchors motivating speech)made people come out.
i really wish that yfe 's website had diffrent heads ...for diffrent kind of suggestions
and if ur looking for issues id suggest...read pro reservation comments on yfe site ..they'll give u great issues that u can use
i am cut-pasting something i wrote on yfe website...hope it gives u some insight on what im trying to say
As for yfe,after reading the two side pro n anti quota..i genuinely have a question …what does yfe actually want ?
If u want roll back or increase in seats and the committee ,then allegations levied at u become true cause u are in the end fighting for cause of ‘your own’…not that its not ok with me, I still support ..but advice u to get little diplomatic to get even opposing people like suryas support (getting a little selfish is not against the law )
BUT if u are actually for ‘equality ‘ then u have to ask for more and the fight does not end with getting ur 2 demands met. And mr surya id like for u to agree with me here …placing an average candidate in ‘best’ institute dosent help really ..it helps nobody ..how about ensuring average institutes for average candidates..and then we need a formula like reservation in private institutes and some one will have to raise a voice for that ….but only after ensuring that it will actually serve the best …for all.
I invite ur comments and you can visit my blog www.citizen4equality.blogspot.com neeti
AND PEOPLE CALLING YFE SELFISH PLEASE REALISE U ARE SELFISH TOO, JUST BY SUPPORTING QUOTA U ARE TRING TO FOOL YOUR COINCIENCE THAT U DID A NOBEL JOB ,AUR AAP MAHAAN HAIN . IF U SO GENUINELY CARE FOR THE PEOPLE FOR WHOM THIS QUOTA IS MEANT ..PLEASE ENSURE IT IS PROPERLY BEING IMPLEMENTED , IT ACTUALLY HAS BENEFITS…….AND YES U NEED TO DO MUCH MUCH MORE FOR THE CAUSE OF PEOPLE U SEEM TO SOO CARE ABOUT, AND THIS I SAY TO BOTH YFE N PRO-QUOTA PEOPLE.
hi, we were tryn to say quite a lot of things to each other so.it got a bit confusing..now ill say things one by one n u can give me ur thoughts
the first thing is ,and iv mentioned it bfore,evrytime we use certain terms starts a debate of "we need to uplift weeker section of society" and blah blah as if we are fighting for 27% resrvation n not 50 % ...so i say,that we need to hide our cause...like never mention the real thing we want (that is roll back) and ask for everything under the sun ......never mention reservation again ..till the time yfe is sitting in the pmo office n ppl r ready to give us roll back +commitee+sun+moon +as's head..so that we just stop
like true trade union leaders we should never let the real cause show or come into light
now if i knew the how and what..id b in parliament not here
but im hoping 17,000 members..maybe someone will come up with something
ur views please
ore facts for Gautier to chew on
Published by shivam June 21st, 2006 in caste. 5 Comments
About Francois Gautier’s article on Brahmins being today’s Dalits, Raja Swamy writes on a SAJA list:
Gautier’s claims reek of chicanery with the facts.
Consider the following, especially in the light of the Brahmin population not exceeding 3% of the total population of India. Source: Caste, Ethnicity and Exclusion in South Asia: The Role of Affirmative Action Policies in Building Inclusive Societies, DL Sheth (UNDP - HDR 2004) 2004/13
Exhibit 1:
Part II—Table 4: Percent Representation of Brahmins and other Upper Caste Members to the elite all-India Services: Indian Administrative Service (IAS), Indian Foreign Service (IFS), Indian Police Service (IPS) during the period when Reservations Policy did not make an impact:
Services: 1947-56, 1957-63
IAS: 34%, 36%
IFS: 22%, 22%
IPS: 31%, 21%
Other services: 38%, 29%
Source: V. Subramaniam, ‘Social Background of India’s Administrators’. Reproduced from H. Mehta and H. Patel (eds.), Dynamics of Reservations Policy (New Delhi, 1985), p. 99.
Exhibit 2:
Part II—Table 8: Table Showing Castewise Representation in Managerial Cadre (non-Government Sector)—1971
Percentage in the cadre of manager
Brahmins: 41.4%
Source: Jain Sagar C., Indian Manager: His social origin and career, 1971. Reproduced from H. Mehta and H. Patel (eds.), Dynamics of Reservations Policy (New Delhi, 1985), p. 98.
Additionally, almost all of the highest offices in the Indian government have been held by Brahmins (almost all Prime Ministers except a couple including the current one), a great number of senior academic positions, etc. With such privilege available to Brahmins, it seems bizarre that Gautier and followers claim Brahmins are oppressed.
But then again, when representatives of privileged groups, and particularly those like Gautier invested in reactionary and retrogade movements supportive of social privilege (Hindutva in his case), cry foul, it is not difficult to see why they do so: threats to privilege are considered attacks on fundamental rights by defenders. No wonder the VHP’s elder “statesman” Giriraj Kishore once remarked not too long ago that the abolition of the caste system would constitute an attack on his “human rights.”
The devil doctors exposed by the IBN-CNN raise a number of questions?
Are these doctors meritwallahs or from depressed classes?
Why the so-called upper caste merit wallahs doctors turned out to be devils ? We dont say depressed people cant do it, but till date none has been found in this racket.
This racket clearly shows why the doctors dont want to expand medical education ?
There is huge money in this profession which has become synonymous with dalali, anything can be fixed for money?
The IMA must tell why merit wallahs were found doing this, as it feels that they are the upholders of hippocrates oath in this country. The IMA itself is is battleground of corruption and sleaze, and there are many more skeletons in the cupboard.
Hacker docs in the dock, IMA promises action
CNN-IBN
Posted Saturday , July 29, 2006 at 21:17
Updated Sunday , July 30, 2006 at 10:59 Email Print
New Delhi: After CNN-IBN and DIG exposed doctors who cut off beggars' limbs for a price to help the beggar mafia the Indian Medical Association (IMA) has promised to prosecute the erring doctors.
Dr Ajay Kumar, National President Elect of the Indian Medical Association has said that the doctors will be arrested immediately.
"If they are registered with the IMA then their medical license will be immediately suspended," he said.
The police have already taken Dr P K Bansal for questioning. He runs a clinic named Orthomat in Delhi's Old Rajinder Nagar locality.
Dr Bansal had agreed to amputate the limbs of a beggar despite knowing that the law prohibits amputation by will.
Another doctor, Ghaziabad-based Ajay Agarwal took money to amputate healthy limbs of a DIG investigator who posed as a prospective beggar.
People entered Agarwal's house in Ghaziabad and demanded action against the erring doctor.
In a sting operation, a team of CNN-IBN reporters exposed orthopaedic surgeon Ajay Agarwal's unethical practice.
Dr Agarwal put the fake beggar through a series of medical tests at his nursing home.
The surgeon pocketed Rs 4,000 as advance for the operation from the team while also giving advice on how the amputation could be made to look legal.
When CNN-IBN reached Dr Ajay Agarwal at the Noida Civil Hospital, the cameraperson was pushed and abused.
It was in fact Dr Ajay Agarwal who had referred Dr P K Bansal to the investigative team as part of amputation nexus.
Dr Ajay Agarwal is absconding and the police are trying to track him down.
CNN-IBN had also exposed Dr Arvind Agarwal of Bareilly.
Dr Agarwal, who is also the Secretary of the Orthopaedic Association of Bareilly is now absconding.
His wife says he has not returned since Saturday afternoon.
When questioned about Dr Agarwal, his wife, Dr Neera Agarwal said,”If he has not come then how can I tell you?”
The police are now looking out for him. The Senior Superintendent of Police (SSP), Bareilly, Anand Swaroop said, "We are looking for him and have contacted IMA for cooperation."
Dude.. reservation can be abolished bt it cant be done instantaneously... It needs time and should be done slowly and gradually
I think that it should be implemented at the undergradutate level before jumping onto the post grauate level.
I can quote one instance where i know about this policy.....
I will not name the college:
The problem is that in a college the seats for B.Com are only 31 for general category out of which 15 are reserved for SC/ST and OBC... Can u imagine only 16 seats for all of us. This is a total piece of shit. Iys a very prestigious institute and every dreams of going in that college. But with only such limited seats u can only dream.
The government should really take some hard steps to tackle with this... otherwise it can cause problem in future......
Dear friend,
You dont know about backward class, and i think definately you belongs to upper caste thats why you are telling like this
iam going to tell you that you dont even know about the single thing about casteism. i think you belongs to 'GM' you are a softwawre engineer and i think you born rich or
if not too rich it will some extent of ricness and you dont have a money problem in studying wand society view is good for you, in case of dalit viewing from society is different, i should tell you dont evenknow you that even today also casteism is there in every sectors of politics.
All the upper communities are thinking like yourself only it is a ego and do you know about caste and reservation why?????????
Read DR. B.R.AMBEDKAR Biography
then come to to conclusion not as a General Merit but as a "DALIT"
i want to say that reservation is not good for our india's. because in this way the able person can't get desire post.as i heard that there was a 27%resevation in private sector than i want say that private sector wants ability .he dont want reservation so government should think that rservation not good.as a effect it creat brain drain which we already faced &caste hatered is also there
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